deisel starting problem 200tdi conversion

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deisel starting problem 200tdi conversion

Postby BOW » Wed 11 Feb 2009 1:41 pm

i have just finished putting a disco 200tdi into my 90, i have been running it for the last two weeks and have a major starting issue,
when starting from cold it diesel smokes like like a pig, will only run on two cylinders, has no throttle response, then once it starts to get some heat into the system will cut in on a third cylinder then the fourth, still all the time belching out blue smoke,

i have replaced the heater plugs, and checked the power supply to them, this side of things is working as it should,
i have checked for air in the fuel lines and for leaks, none can be found, i have also replaced the filters as this was a complete new instalation, also used diesel majic injector cleaner as this was recomended to me,

i am now at a loss, once the engine is warm and the temperature has risen the engine runs sweet as a dream, with no problems, the engine ran fine when it was in my disco, there is no restricion on the air intake and all turbo pipes have a nice smooth run, the exhaust down pipe has a smooth route and is free flowing,

can any one help me on this, its spoiling what should be a dam fine conversion, i took my time doing this because i wanted it to look tidy under the bonnet, even going as far sorcing an air box off of the later disco so as the intake pipe work could be neat and tidy, the engine was rebuilt febuary last year, with a new head gassket and all new seals, am i missing something,

PLEASE HELP,

atb,

BOW..
200tdi 90 1988
200tdi disco the shopping trolley
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Postby tim falce » Wed 11 Feb 2009 1:49 pm

Was it running OK in the previous vehicle? It sounds like a timing issue, either the camshaft or pump. Last time I did my cam belt I replaced it slightly out and although it started OK there was lots of grey smoke and a slight misfire until it was warm then it ran OK.
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Postby uzzzze » Wed 11 Feb 2009 2:38 pm

if it runs ok when warm id rule out timing[maby] sounds like oil getin in[rings valves or turbo].
i did same conv on my 90 tappets were completly out ,ran like youres sounds.
also i havent wired my glow plugs up and she starts up instantly even in these temps.
good luck
davyboy 1985 90 200tdi
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Postby tim falce » Wed 11 Feb 2009 6:47 pm

uzzzze wrote:if it runs ok when warm id rule out timing[maby]
Read my post above.
me wrote:lots of grey smoke and a slight misfire until it was warm then it ran OK.
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Postby trailerfitter » Thu 12 Feb 2009 4:20 pm

you have fuel running back from the injectors possibly? Did you replace the injector spill pipes? ( leak back pipes between the injectors)


2000tdi rarely needs heater plugs..........I had a starting and running issue on my 200tdi after I had fitted another disasterous head.....what I found was one of the leak back pipes has split slightly and was letting air in...........on inspection and a little fumble about 2 more pipes split so I changed all the leak back pipes between the injectors.....starts a dream now!!!..... :D
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Postby BOW » Thu 12 Feb 2009 5:26 pm

timing is spot on, checked last nite, not checked the spill pipes , although cant find any trace of a leak, going to do the tappets on saturday, and check all the fuel unions again, thanks for your thoughts guys, if you have any more, let me know, i want this running right, prob going to replace the injectors if it carries on like it is,

atb

BOW. :cry: :cry:
200tdi 90 1988
200tdi disco the shopping trolley
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Postby trailerfitter » Thu 12 Feb 2009 7:44 pm

BOW wrote: , although cant find any trace of a leak,
atb

BOW. :cry: :cry:


no i didn't see one either
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Postby BOW » Wed 18 Mar 2009 8:53 pm

right, i know its been a few weeks, but time for an update,

still chucks out loads of diesel smoke on startup, takes longer to warm up now the weather has changed, but once warm runs ok, i have changed the glow plugs, the injectors, new spill pipes, and all fuel sealing washers, aka copper washers, all to no avail.

i've had 3, yes 3 so called diesel specialist's look at it , and all have been pretty much stumped, i have checked the compression twice, all within tolerance, +/- .5 bar of each other, now have a glow plug on no' 4 cylinder broken due to the centre pushing out of the body.

i have come to the conclusion that this engine wants a fight, so this week end i'm going to pull the head off and check all the valves, seats, push rods, i'm fitting a new lift pump, re checking the injection pump timing, removing all the fuel lines and cleaning them again, re grind all the valve seats and then rebuild the top end.

if you guys can think of any thing else i should do while the top is off please let me know, i will check the turbo while it is off also, even though this is in no way connected to the starting problem.

any ideas folks, and if any one is at a loss for something to do this weekend ,and your in my area, your welcome to pop round for a cuppa, and show a bit of moral support for a bloke at wits end in the battle between man and machine :D

if this does not cure it i'l bin this engine and buy another,

all the best folks,

BOW..
200tdi 90 1988
200tdi disco the shopping trolley
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Postby mick » Wed 18 Mar 2009 9:07 pm

Clutching at straws i know,but change the lift pump as well,and the filter if you hav'nt already.Is the fuel stop solonoid working as it should,you could try running it with the plunger out.
When you've eliminated everything,whatever is left,however unlikely,must be the solution.......
(i think Sherlock Holmes said that)
(or summit similar)
Good luck,Mick.
Just goin down the garage darlin',won't be long......
Tek it ta bits man.
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Postby trailerfitter » Wed 18 Mar 2009 10:07 pm

take a look at my signature picture,...completely rebuilt the engine after having overheating problems and 2 different heads which were both cracked.......I opened up the engine and saw the bores scuffed so the oil was getting past the piston rings..............the picture shows the 3rd head going on


......if this doesn't work I'm going Japanese!!!!!!

anyway why is changing the lift pump clutching at straws?.........I think your fuel is drainng back..... BTW there are 4 valves in the distributor block of the injector pump,....they are in the unions where the injector pipes bolt onto..........not something to take off whilst pump is on the vehicle but,...they do stop the fuel draining back from the injector pipes...........just a though. those valves on the Lcas DPA pump used to break up and kill injectors...on early 2.5 NAD engines....Bosch pumps don't do this but injector pumps do wear up...........GOOD LUCK!

you can see the 4 valves on the back of this pump?

Image
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